Sanding our assholes with 150 grit. Slowly. Lovingly.

amazing rebuttal

This guy was giving a talk on Israeli war crimes and an audience member said she found his rabid antisemitism extremely offensive.

Listen to his rebuttal.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNQSV3BBtZ4
Permalink Idiot 
June 14th, 2012 7:54pm
Yeah, that's very sad.  It's too bad when civility goes out the door.
Permalink SaveTheHubble 
June 14th, 2012 7:58pm
Somebody give that guy a Nobel, or something.
Permalink PigPen 
June 14th, 2012 8:05pm
Not a credit to the Tribe. Up there with Roseanne and Trotsky on the Jews I wish weren't Jews list.
Permalink Shylock 
June 14th, 2012 8:12pm
Yeah, it was so noisy, I had to fast forward to the end.

Where it got weird.  Apparently, he "played the holocaust card", how all his family was killed in Warsaw, etc. etc. etc, Mother, Father, cousins, etc. etc. etc.

And THEN, defended the Palestinians, saying the Israeli's shouldn't use the Holocaust Card to justify their daily oppression of the Palestinians.  Well dude, YOU just played the "Holocaust Card" to silence that girl.

An enormous amount of inconsistency there.  Besides, the only people I've heard claiming the Israeli's are "using the Holocaust Card" ARE Palestinians -- I've never heard an Israeli say "We were abused in the Holocaust, therefore we can abuse the Palestinians".  Just doesn't happen.
Permalink SaveTheHubble 
June 14th, 2012 8:24pm
it happens all the time.
Permalink Colm 
June 14th, 2012 8:28pm
On the other hand, this is one of the reasons I love the Jewish people.  They're like herding cats -- all over the place.

Because, you see, it's when you get a group of fervent idiots all following idiotic dogma from one inspiring but corrupt leader, that you get into trouble.

But with the Jewish people, you get a group of people who think, who have reverence for God, but don't feel it necessary to get everyone to agree with them.  And some have passionate beliefs, but they're all pulling in slightly different directions.

So one or two who think they understand what Israel's problems are, and how they should be solved, and who are completely mistaken about both -- well, unlike some Pastors I know, the amount of damage they can do is not very much.

I like Baptists for the same reason.  Not Southern Baptists, those people have become sheeple.  But American Baptists have the same devotion to the truth.
Permalink SaveTheHubble 
June 14th, 2012 8:32pm
*An enormous amount of inconsistency there.*

What? There was no inconsistency at all. He (it appears) paralleled Israeli actions with those of Nazi Germany. She cries about how offensive that is to Germans (? did I hear that right?) and people who lived under German rule. He says that he is in a very good position to judge that -- which he is -- and he doesn't buy that argument.

There is zero inconsistency there.

Have you ever noticed that you back the Israeli side (or what you perceive as such) 100% of the time? Why is that?
Permalink df 
June 14th, 2012 8:33pm
I don't know.  Why does it seem you're backing the Palestinians every time?

Must be ben-Godwin's law.
Permalink SaveTheHubble 
June 14th, 2012 8:35pm
*Why does it seem you're backing the Palestinians every time?*

Ha ha, and I'm also an Apple fanboy. You have a hilarious memory.

I don't "back" the Palestinians at all. Nonetheless I despise the "but...Nazis!" shortcut to all criticism of the current situation. This guy apparently is rightly saying that if you want to bring up Nazis, it should vilify some behavior instead of justify it.
Permalink df 
June 14th, 2012 8:39pm
Well, we agree there.
Permalink SaveTheHubble 
June 14th, 2012 8:45pm
"It's too bad when civility goes out the door."

Pretty odd from the delete and purge and ban fascist.
Permalink Send private email zed 
June 14th, 2012 9:20pm
>Have you ever noticed that you back the Israeli side (or what >you perceive as such) 100% of the time? Why is that?

Because he's a sucker for slick propaganda. Hence the constant support for democrats and the washington consensus as well. If savethehubble supports something there is nearly always a well oiled and funded media machine behind it.
Permalink Colm 
June 14th, 2012 10:02pm
Doesn't it bother you, making up such transparent falsehoods?  I know it bothers me.
Permalink SaveTheHubble 
June 14th, 2012 10:26pm
"Well-oiled"?  Really?  Me?  Why I'd be so flattered, if it wasn't so obviously false.
Permalink SaveTheHubble 
June 14th, 2012 10:27pm
This guy's ENTIRE family was murdered by the Nazis in concentration camps.

He has noticed that Israel is committing war crimes and criticizes how they shame the memory of the dead by doing so, and running the absurd Holocaust industry to try to make money and get political power off of the genocide.

As a result the ADL has him labelled a "Holocaust denier", and he is banned from entering Israel.

This shows how disreputable the ADL and Israel are.
Permalink Idiot 
June 14th, 2012 10:31pm
--Doesn't it bother you, making up such transparent falsehoods?
--I know it bothers me.

what's transparently false about it? the israeli media machine is incredibly well funded and well run. fact.
Permalink Colm 
June 14th, 2012 11:36pm
If you want to see how Israel uses WW2 history to silence their critics, look at what happened to Guenter Grass.

Funnnily, just after WW2 the Zionists had very little respect for Holocaust survivors. They didn't want to be associated with "losers".
Permalink Quant 
June 15th, 2012 4:22am
Nothing inconsistent at all.

He says that he does not *want* to "play the holocaust card" (as he calls mentioning the fact that he lost his family in the holocaust).

But is encouraged to do so by the fact that the crying girl is using an emotional trick to try to deflect attention from the basic logic of the argument.

Which is that oppression of people based on race, creed, religion is evil - regardless of who the perpetrators and victims are.

And he makes the very pertinent point that it is the martyrdom of his family that compels him to make this stance.

Entirely, consistent, logical and, most importantly - humane.
Permalink eek 
June 15th, 2012 5:19am
Another guy who "played the Holocaust card": http://1humanity.blogspot.co.uk/2009/10/marek-edelmans-legacy-israels-most.html
Permalink Quant 
June 15th, 2012 5:26am
>> I've never heard an Israeli say "We were abused in the Holocaust, therefore we can abuse the Palestinians". Just doesn't happen.

Somebody vote a Nobel for the guy saying this too.
Permalink Io 
June 15th, 2012 8:56am
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crocodile_tears

Crocodile tears (or superficial sympathy) are a false or insincere display of emotion such as a hypocrite crying fake tears of grief. The phrase gives its name to crocodile tears syndrome, an uncommon consequence of recovery from Bell's palsy where faulty regeneration of the facial nerve causes sufferers to shed tears while eating.

Such an appropriate term.
Permalink Kenny 
June 15th, 2012 2:24pm
Except that young lady really seemed sincerely tearful.  But sure, "sentiment" shouldn't matter in big decisions like this as much as logic and reason.  Trying to sway logic and reason by tearful appeals to emotion is pretty bogus -- however genuine the tears are.
Permalink SaveTheHubble 
June 15th, 2012 2:29pm
##Except that young lady really seemed sincerely tearful.

But why would she be tearful?

It's not like *she* was ever in the concentration camps. Neither was he of course, but he is only one generation removed from them, *and* he was not turning on the water works.

Big girls don't cry. You want to cry? Go and play in the sand pit.
Permalink PigPen 
June 15th, 2012 2:38pm
The 1960's called and they want their song back.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Girls_Don't_Cry_(The_Four_Seasons_song)
Permalink SaveTheHubble 
June 15th, 2012 2:48pm
Why would she be tearful?  We don't really know, we didn't see the entire lecture leading up to that, and there's way too much noise and shouting and pontificating after that to even know.

She said something about "Germany", and then chaos ensued.

But you and I aren't really disagreeing here, I already said logic and reason should have a larger role than sentiment.
Permalink SaveTheHubble 
June 15th, 2012 2:50pm
++PigPen

Kind of difficult to have an honest debate about certain things in the US when one side tries to shut the other side down with accusations of being racist/sexist/whatever.
Permalink Some dude on the 'net 
June 17th, 2012 8:10am
"one side tries to shut the other side down with accusations of being racist/sexist/whatever"

or with accusations of "political correctness", "liberal bias", etc.
Permalink Quant 
June 18th, 2012 4:56am

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