Sanding our assholes with 150 grit.

Java, I hate you

Java is crap, I hate using it but because it pays the bills I have to (for right now anyway).

But, everyday, I think about how painful it is to work with the technology.
Permalink Bot Berlin 
July 30th, 2007 4:37pm
Ditto.
Permalink Full name 
July 30th, 2007 4:41pm
But then again, it is so pervasive.  Eg, I use java ides/tools.  I use java servers and some java console applications.  Write java code for the servers

I wonder if python and ruby would suffer from the same general issues (unresponsive, buggy sometimes, resource hog)

As I know, I dont know of any IDEs written in python.  Django/Rails is a good server though.  Dont know about python based console apps either?
Permalink Bot Berlin 
July 30th, 2007 4:44pm
The first step in an amicable divorce is recognizing that it is good for both of you.
Permalink Send private email sharkfish 
July 30th, 2007 4:59pm
"The first step in an amicable divorce is recognizing that it is good for both of you."

I like that, you are really becoming wiser.  I wonder if it is the weight-lifting.

Or maybe, I am becoming slower.
Permalink Bot Berlin 
July 30th, 2007 5:00pm
Neither.

Sharkfish is always brighter than you...
Permalink Shaking head 
July 30th, 2007 5:04pm
"Shaking head"  -- Linux, is that you.  You just have a crush on sharkish, your bias.
Permalink Bot Berlin 
July 30th, 2007 5:05pm
What about the good things in Java, like the way you can rearrange the class path without having to relink things, or put a modified class file in front of a jar file to temporarily change some code?
Permalink Send private email bon vivant 
July 30th, 2007 5:08pm
Come to the Dark Side, Bot.
Permalink .NET 
July 30th, 2007 5:08pm
I think, as usual, the problem is between the chair and the keyboard.

Dveloping for Java applications can be nice, if the "enterprise architect" are more competent.
Permalink Rick Zeng 
July 30th, 2007 5:10pm
"What about the good things in Java, like the way you can rearrange the class path without having to relink things, or put a modified class file in front of a jar file to temporarily change some code?"

That is what I am saying, java has good features, but some that just drive you nuts.  And some not even related to java but related to java created apps.  Eg, Eclipse/WSAD take up 200MB of memory per instance.
Permalink Bot Berlin 
July 30th, 2007 5:11pm
Well I'm not fond of you either, you schmuck.
Permalink Java 
July 30th, 2007 5:12pm
Switch to IronRuby.

http://www.iunknown.com/2007/07/a-first-look-at.html

>> In micro-benchmarks which measure method call performance, we are significantly faster than Ruby 1.8.6. In micro-benchmarks which measure library performance, we are on par with Ruby 1.8.6; we expect to see performance improvements in these benchmarks in the future. In micro-benchmarks that involve raising exceptions, we are slower than Ruby 1.8.6; but if control flow on your program's critical path involves raising exceptions you may want to rethink your design :) <<

One thing that MSFT does well is optimize for the common case.  Their J++ code was much faster than Sun's.
Permalink Send private email xampl 
July 30th, 2007 6:51pm
yeah but their J++ code ran on one operating system.
Permalink Send private email arg! 
July 30th, 2007 7:43pm
IIRC, J++ was a Java clone.
Permalink Send private email Colm 
July 30th, 2007 7:53pm
the second IronRuby, Django, wtf ever esoteric language you care to spew has the support, the documentation, the developer community, the capability/scalability/maturity/portability, the feature set that java has, you will be in the exact same boat. You think anything you write in IronRuby will be maintainable in 12 years? wtf man?

why does no one get this?

Honestly. Is it egoism that you know a language that most don't? Is it the lack of desire to master the platform that you are paid to develop in? I dunno man.

Sure Java has its complexities, its downsides. But on the whole you'd have to be a maroon to tie any corporate project to a language/platform du jour based on personal bias.
Permalink Send private email arg! 
July 30th, 2007 7:53pm
J++ broke all sorts of Java specs and could only be run within the MS engine, supported only on windows.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visual_J++
Permalink Send private email arg! 
July 30th, 2007 7:57pm
IronRuby is just ruby implenmented on dotNet runtime. It should have the scalability of dotNet.

It's not guaranteered to be good, but I don't think you can't dismiss it quite like that :)

Actually, if you want, use either IronPython or JRuby because they are implemented by qualified people. Not sure about IronRuby though.
Permalink Rick Zeng 
July 30th, 2007 7:58pm
the scalability of .Net is impressive. The portability is not :)
Permalink Send private email arg! 
July 30th, 2007 8:00pm
Yeah, try to port from WebSphere to WebLogic :)
Permalink Rick Zeng 
July 30th, 2007 8:03pm
touche, dude.

tou fucking che.
Permalink Send private email arg! 
July 30th, 2007 8:06pm
I feel the same pain.

Its a mutual hate-ness for me and java...:'(.
Permalink Bounthunter 
August 1st, 2007 5:12am

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