A bunch of cunts, mostly in the Australian sense. Except that one guy.

Moving to New York

After this role I am at now, I want to move to New York and possibly do freelance work(or no work and live off savings).  What should I be preparing for? I really excited about it and I have always wanted to move there, at least for a year or two.

What places are good for boring, yuppie types? And, is $1200 a month good for one bedroom apartment?

I am saving now, so I can probably do it over 6 months or so.
Permalink Berlin Brown 
August 23rd, 2005
If your rent budget is $1200 a month for your 1br, you can forget about living anywhere near a 'yuppie' area.

What should you be preparing for? To go through your savings about 3x as fast as you expect to.
Permalink dave 
August 23rd, 2005
Just fooling around - why stop at New York? If you're single go live in Europe. After the kids are in college the Mrs. and I are considering working in Prague for a few years...

Philo
Permalink Philo 
August 23rd, 2005
Well, I heard you can really live there. I have only been bored in the other places I have lived.
Permalink Berlin Brown 
August 23rd, 2005
Philo

"After the kids are in college the Mrs. and I are considering working in Prague for a few years"

Cool.

Me moving to NYC is a little bit more practical for me. Plus I will probably look for work or freelance stuff, a little bit easier there than outside of the US
Permalink Berlin Brown 
August 23rd, 2005
1200 in manhattan or near it will not get you a 1 bedroom unless you live with a roommate and that would mean converting the one bedroom into a 2.

1 bedrooms in manhattan are around 2500-3000. Studios are around 2200-2400.

You could live in Queens or way out in Brooklyn (like park slope) where you could probably get a 1 bedroom for 1200.
Permalink Michael H. Pryor 
August 23rd, 2005
You cannot touch a 1br in park slope for $1200. Rents there are as high or even higher than Manhattan now.

For that budget, maybe Bushwick or Sunset Park. Not exactly 24/7 excitement out there, feels a lot like northern New Jersey.
Permalink dave 
August 23rd, 2005
I should also add that the version of NYC peddled to the rest of the country is basically a fantasy.

If you are affluent, (meaning NYC affluent, i.e. $200k+ per year) it can be a great place to live. For working stiffs, it sucks.

There's a ton of stuff to do in NYC, but if you really ask new yorkers about what their lives are like, you'll find that they never do any of the fun stuff you do when you are there on vacation. They're working all the damn time (work hours are way longer in NYC than the rest of the country, esp. in IT jobs). Weekends are usually spent catching up on sleep.

If you are determined to move there, get a short term sublet.
Permalink dave 
August 23rd, 2005
Interesting.
Permalink Berlin Brown 
August 23rd, 2005
You are brave, Berlin Brown. I hear New Yorkers eat people.
Permalink sharkfish 
August 23rd, 2005
I've only eaten a few people. That's a totally overblown statement. I guess it's just another one of the things people hear about NYers that few of us do on a regular basis.

Berlin - distance from NYC/cool areas is inversely proportional to rent. Michael Pryor is in the right direction, but remember, he's the CEO of a company that makes "crazy money." You may be able to find something on the outskirts of the cool areas (Park Slope, Williamsburg) for $1200. I'm a ~45 minute train ride from the city, in probably the least cool neighborhood in the city and pay $960. Though, I got my apartment around 7 years ago and prices may have gone up considerably, but I doubt the area I'm in has gone above $1200.

If you want to party all night and then stumble home drunk, you'll end up paying a lot of money in rent... and drinks, and food and...

What makes NY unique is the sheer size of it. It's tiny. The geographic constraints of it being an island sort of dictated that all the cool stuff would be in the center, and everyplace else was mostly housing.
Permalink MarkTAW 
August 23rd, 2005
"You are brave, Berlin Brown. I hear New Yorkers eat people."

Nonesense!

Manhattan is the only city in America with the highest concentration of interesting and relatively high IQ people. And personally, I don't consider it part of the US too.

I have a friend who lives in the Village and whenever he's outside of US, he refrains from calling himself American. He just goes, "I am a New Yorker."
Permalink Dan Denman 
August 24th, 2005
I live in Westchester, 30 mins train ride from NYC. Rent is $1700.
Permalink 2cents 
August 24th, 2005
But Westchester is that snooty area where people like the Clintons live.
Permalink MarkTAW 
August 24th, 2005
Dan,

You consider yourself sophisticated and worldly, but have never heard about the head hunter/cannibal tribes of Manhattan?

You really need to get out more.
Permalink Jim Rankin 
August 24th, 2005
"After this role I am at now, I want to move to New York and possibly do freelance work(or no work and live off savings). What should I be preparing for?"

Prepare $10,000 just to move into your new rental apartment (first, last, security, broker's fee)

Prepare to spend $100 dollars per day, just living a normal New York lifestyle.

"What places are good for boring, yuppie types?"

The upper west side, the west village in manhattan, park slope and carrol gardens for Brooklyn. You don't want to live in any of the other boroughs or New Jersey - it just isn't the same thing. Actually in my opinion EVERYWHERE in Manhattan is now fair game for boring, yuppie types.

It really depends on what kind of bars in which you want to do your drinking...

" And, is $1200 a month good for one bedroom apartment?"

If you are going to share that one bedroom apartment with your yuppie S.O. who is pitching in the other $1200 a month needed to cover the actual $2400/month rent it will cost. As far as I can tell there is nowhere on the island of manhattan or brooklyn where you can get a decent $1200 apartment. HOWEVER, maybe in harlem... see below...

Also I've looked at your blog and it seems like you are a black dude. this gives you some other options. you could live in Fort Greene/Clinton Hill in Brooklyn or one of the nicer parts of Harlem and save rent and fit in a lot better than us asians. Sorry to bring race into the picture, that's how it is. You will be suprised at how racially segregated the Northeast is on black/white terms when compared to the Southeast or even places like Phoenix, LA, and Vegas.

But... that said... new york rules. Don't sweat the money stuff at all. People move to NYC every day with nothing and usually manage to do ok provided they are determined to "do ok."
Permalink  
August 24th, 2005
"Prepare to spend $100 dollars per day, just living a normal New York lifestyle."

$100 * 30 (days) = $3,000

$3,000 + 2,400 (rent) = $5,400

%5,400 * 12 = $31,800

$31,800 * 1.5 (tax) = $47,700

So a typical NY lifestyle is $47,700 pretax. Sounds about right to me, especially for someone intent on living the NY highlife, so to speak. That is, never cook, eat out twice a week, see movies regularly, and maybe even the occasional broadway show, and... well, let's not even talk about drinking, I have (alcoholic) friends who have adamantly refused to go out with less than $200 in their hand, and drinking can easily turn a $30 per person meal into a $100 per person meal.

But as the previous poster said, don't sweat that stuff. Any city is more about the people than anything else, and and if the drug addicts and beggers in the village can have a good time on ... well, whatever's left after they buy their smack, then so can you on any budget.
Permalink MarkTAW 
August 24th, 2005
Oh yeah, and I talked to a girl who worked in the Border's Bookstore today. She told me she lived in the mid 60's on the west side (nice neighborhood, near Lincoln Center). I didn't bother to ask how many roommates she has to afford that, but if she can afford it on her Border's Books salary, I'm sure you can afford to live in the same area. I also used to work with someone who made (I'm guessing) around $80k who lived in the same neighborhood. Again, I didn't ask about roommates.

I also knew a girl from work who lived in the East Village with 5 roommates, and another guy who lives in Williamsburg with.. I think 3 roommates. He used to have 4, but that guy was paying about $1,000 a month for a bed behind a curtain in the common area. They were totally ripping him off. The girl in the East Village said that she'd show up at times and find people.. total strangers, sleeping on the floor in the living room. But this is all just part of the experience, and nothing to get freaked out about.

The idea of having roommates may turn you off at first, but you get used to it. And hey, you get economies of scale. That is, when you all order pizza, instead of tipping $3 for the delivery, you all chip in and tip $6, saving each of you a dollar.
Permalink MarkTAW 
August 24th, 2005
I read somewhere that CBGB was pretty much out of danger. Was that news little premature?
Permalink Jeff Barton 
August 24th, 2005
I heard they were thinking about moving it to Las Vegas.
Wouldn't be the same, but at least they'd still be open.
Man, I wished I'd been able to see The Cars there.
Permalink example 
August 24th, 2005
not exactly new york city but i live in jersey city and can be in mid-town within 15 minutes via PATH train. my rent including utilities (no cable/internet) is $800. hoboken night life is comparable if not exceeding the night life of manhattan and is located approximately 2 minutes away via cab or 10 minutes away via feet.
Permalink  
August 24th, 2005
>%5,400 * 12 = $31,800

$64,800 by my calculator.

Been a while since I lived in Manhattan, but back in the mid-90s I seem to recall that landlords wanted your annual salary to be a minimum of 50x your monthly rent. So to qualify for that $2,400 a month apartment, you'd need to be pulling in $120K pre-tax (or have roommates).
Permalink John C. 
August 24th, 2005
Oh, and another little ray of sunshine...

Late night subway service has been cut way back in NYC in the last few years. When I lived there I took trains home late at night after an evening out all the time.

When I visited again in July, I couldn't believe how infrequently the trains ran. A 30 minute train trip with, say, one transfer during the day can now take easily 90 minutes late at night.

Moral of the story? If you plan on living out in the boros, also plan to drop $30 on a cab home every time you go out in the city.
Permalink embittered ex-NY'er 
August 24th, 2005
> $64,800 by my calculator.

*shrug* I must have plugged the wrong numbers into CALC.exe.

The standard metric is your housing costs should be no more than 1/3 of your net income, and I know plenty of people with shitty jobs who live in the city.

I don't know anything about Jersey. Is Jersey City just outside of a tunnel or something?
Permalink MarkTAW 
August 25th, 2005
(blank) sez : "not exactly new york city but i live in jersey city ..."

<obligatory>
(points) B&T! Uncleeeaaan!
</obligatory>
Permalink Snark 
August 25th, 2005
Jersey City and Hoboken are both on the NJ side of the Holland tunnel. There's a huge nightlife (re Washington Street) in Hoboken and it's flooded with 20 and 30 somethings. And the rent is much more reasonable and a PATH train into the city (with various stops.. WTC, Christopher, Herald Sq, etc) is $1.50 and it runs all night.
Permalink Elliot 
August 26th, 2005

This topic was orginally posted to the off-topic forum of the
Joel on Software discussion board.

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