...consensual sex with a 15, 16, or 17 year old?

I'm not so sure. I was a normal 16 year old, and back in 1985, the police said my parents could not have the 30 year old man who had sex with me put in jail because it was consensual.

In the news today, I saw a TV news item about a high school music teacher who has been indicted (orange jump suit and mug shot) for having sex with several high school girls. The acts were all consensual. They are talking about putting him away for 20 years.

While I do not condone such behavior, I think the potential sentence is harsh. I also do not understand why all the hullabaloo. Just fire the guy.

The statutory rape stuff is crap. Don't forget that whatever he gets, when he gets out he's got to register with the sex offender registry as a rapist for life.

His life is effectively over.

Philo

I think a 30 year old who has sex with a 16 year old girl deserves what he gets, and I have no sympathy. Same for relatively similiar age ratios.

Mature for her age and blah blah blah the fact is that it's 99.9% likely she's got no clue what she's getting into.

It's just (consentual) sex!

You'd probably get less time from beating a girl half to death than having sex with her -- that's messed up.

Yeah, I think ruining his life is probably chivalry taken far too far. How badly is she going to fare after having consensual sex at 16? How badly was sharkfish ruined?

I think it's quite clear that sharkfish was UTTERLY ruined by SOMETHING.

Maybe that's why I'm a homo?

I was thinking it's probably why you're a bitch.

Ahem.

*Racist* bitch.

Let's keep things straight.

Uh, so to speak.

[g,d,r]

Philo

>I think it's quite clear that sharkfish was UTTERLY ruined
>by SOMETHING.

Yeah yeah, you oughta be really proud... :)

by which argument mark, you yourself must have been seduced by a man long before you reached 16 :)

Jokes about underage sex aren't funny Jesus. You taught me that.

The fact that he was a teacher - a person in authority - and they were students probably contributed significantly to the penalty. That is an extraordinary breach of trust.

But seriously. Anytime young people are taken advantage of by adults, the other adults inadvertently make the kid feel guilty. The young girls, in this case, will probably live with the lifelong issues, including broken relationships with their fathers.

If your daughter is involved with an older man before her sixteenth or seventeenth birthday, you are probably going to feel some pain, guilt, and pass that on to your daughter.

I can see Mark Warner doing that to his daughter, easily, because my own father felt the same way as he does.

So far, so good, sharkfish. I'll let you know in 10 or 15 years when she's twice as successful as you'll ever be. :)

"The fact that he was a teacher - a person in authority - and they were students probably contributed significantly to the penalty. That is an extraordinary breach of trust."

My seducer was a member of the community, and helped run a teen jobs program for a youth center. Nobody gave a shit then, and nobody would give a shit now (except for my parents) because of various societal reasons I wish not to taint this thread with.

" So far, so good, sharkfish. I'll let you know in 10 or 15 years when she's twice as successful as you'll ever be. :)"

Um, why does this have to be so personal.

Just trying to have a discussion. If you can't be a grown-up, don't participate. :)

Of course, 16 is legal as breathing here.

LOL

As usual, sharky, you're the one who made it personal.

And at any rate, it wasn't even entirely personal. It's quite evident that you will never be very successful. You're your own worst enemy.

It is called "statutory rape" because our legal system says that "people under age X are incapable of giving consent for sex." Where X ranges from 12 to 18 (depending on state, and one state used to say that was at age 7). Similarly, people under age Y are incapable of legally entering into contracts of any kind at all (usually 18, unless you get an emancipation declaration from a judge).

In my not-very scientific polls, I found that more than 3/4 of lesbians were survivors of childhood sexual abuse: (step)father, uncle, teacher, brother. In similar polls of heterosexual women, the number is under 1/4.

"Jokes about underage sex aren't funny Jesus. You taught me that."

heh. Rules of thumb are for the stupid. The intelligent folk deal in specific cases.

Jokes about underage sex that involve mark being the underage victim are *always* funny. its a very specific special case.

"The fact that he was a teacher "

totally agree. whatever ones feeling about underage sex in the general sense, teachers and others in positions of authority have *got* to avoid such betrayals.

Gee Jesus, and I thought we got along.

"As usual, sharky, you're the one who made it personal."

reread the thread mark.

<g> personally I find the sight of you two beating each other over the head hugely entertaining, but in point of fact this particular effort was *clearly* instigated by you.

"I thought we got along."

:) we do, Im rather a fan of your best efforts.

What do you think about a 30 year old dating a 20 year old. Because that is the situation I'm in...

"And at any rate, it wasn't even entirely personal. It's quite evident that you will never be very successful. You're your own worst enemy."

Ah, but see I don't feel the need to debate that. I'm comfortable in my own skin.

It is very sad the way you poke at other people's open sores and laugh as they bleed. I find you despicable in that way. It makes you entertaining (people would prefer that other's behave like asses rather than themselves).

You are the perfect ass-clown, at least in that regard. The fact that I have empathy for you and wished you well has never been returned and obviously, at some point, I hurt you so bad with my written words you will never recover (I struck at a nerve when I didn't mean to?)

Pity, it is. You probably have redeeming qualities underneath that low self-esteem defense mechanism.

The worst thing about it is that you rest comfortably, believing I'm a racist or whatever, when in fact, others feel the same way and don't feel the constant need to insult me and I have had positive enjoyable conversations with many whom/who feel just the same as you about my position on certain issues.

Are you so down on people that you think you cannot influence them positively, so you hide behind insults? Did you ever think that maybe your intellect and wisdom could somehow rub off on me if you deign to validate anything I say, without having to be so ugly?

No, you don't. Because you are the worst kind of human; one who does not believe in human kind because he does not believe in himself.

I hope you get well. For your kids, at least. Your black /white thinking is going to be fun for them to torture you with when they become teenagers. And they will respond poorly to that attitude of yours, believe me.

There was something on the news the other day about some guy (can't evwen remember the state he was in) who'd raped a seven or eight year old ... several times and he was give the ultimate ... two fucking months!!! I'll see if I can track down a cite.

<shudder>Can't do that kind of searching anymore ... this one will have to do. I suspect the "news" my have erred and said seven instead of seventeen::
http://fredericksburg.com/News/FLS/2005/122005/12232005/1223daniel

I would give him a 15 year sentence and permanently ban him from teaching or other contact with children. It's because he's their teacher and also because there were so many of the girls, meaning this was certainly not 'foolish love', but was a predator/prey relationship.

sharky well said.

"It is very sad the way you poke at other people's open sores and laugh as they bleed"

now *thats* just going to far. its one of my greatest pleasures in life.

really sharky, its all very well to whinge on about it, but wtf would we have to talk about here on ?off if not other peoples shortcomings?

"Jokes about underage sex that involve mark being the underage victim are *always* funny. its a very specific special case."

Mark was quite right to call me up on this, what I *should* have said was:

"Jokes about underage sex that involve members of ?off being the underage victim are *always* funny. its a very specific special case."

...and jokes about nailing involving Jesus H Christ :)