Nobody likes to be called a dummy by a dummy.

I can now proclaim with some confidence

That Ruby is the most retarded fucking programming language I've ever seen.
Permalink muppet 
March 21st, 2005
You've never used Informix's 4GL language.
Permalink Miles Archer 
March 21st, 2005
Why do you say that Muppet?. Please give valid reasons
Permalink Karthik 
March 21st, 2005
Can you expound on this one? One of my co-workers starting plugging Ruby on Rails a few weeks ago.

What is Ruby doing that is kicking your ass?
Permalink Geoff Moller 
March 21st, 2005
The syntax is just ponderous. ONEROUS. Maybe there's a reason for it, but I can't wrap my head around functions that look like this:

define function
...
...
...
end

etc. It just seems needlessly verbose. Not to mention the whole syntax (ie keywords) remind me of some sort of assembler, or something. It's just not intuitive.
Permalink muppet 
March 21st, 2005
You think they are valid reasons? :P
Permalink Rick Tang 
March 21st, 2005
You know, Rick, knock the chip off your shoulder, dude. I'm getting pretty tired of you.
Permalink muppet 
March 21st, 2005
I agree I am getting tiresome.

But my intetion is good. I was sort of like you before...
Permalink Rick Tang 
March 21st, 2005
No, you're not very good at it.
Permalink muppet 
March 21st, 2005
I don't mind that 'end' syntax. The VB style syntax Python is not verbose enough. Imagine you are editing/rediting some old code and you need to take out a function.

def abc(n):
if x == b:
  for n in m:
    try:
      n = m
    except:


Normally, you dont get that far in PY code, but what if you want to move a block around, becomes confusing.

I dont know this Ruby, but I think it is funny all these java developers are dropping on J2EE, all that work over 10 years. They are gone.
Permalink Berlin Brown 
March 21st, 2005
Hey Muppet?

Whats wrong with that function definition???. Every language has something like that. VB has

Private Function

End

or something like that. ITs syntax is bad too and not intuitive.

The only language i liked was Team developer from gupta corp. But that company isnt doing well.
Permalink Karthik 
March 21st, 2005
Just for reference, Muppet, which languages do you consider good?
Permalink Rick Tang 
March 21st, 2005
I use C#, Java, PHP, and Perl just about every day.
Permalink muppet 
March 21st, 2005
Maybe I'm misremembering, but two months ago weren't you complaining about C#?

Philo
Permalink Philo 
March 21st, 2005
I think you're misremembering, but I'm not sure.

I'm sure there's SOMETHING in C# that pisses me off :)
Permalink muppet 
March 21st, 2005
Like the pointless generics coming in 2.0?
Permalink Brad Wilson 
March 21st, 2005
"define function ... end"

A very common complaint about Perl is that there are two many punctuation characters and it looks like line noise. Maybe Ruby has tried to remedy those complaints?
Permalink Ian Boys 
March 21st, 2005
by requiring four or five keystrokes instead of one in perl? I'll take my nonsense line-noise language, thanks.
Permalink muppet 
March 22nd, 2005
So in other words, ruby is a language for programmers who are incapable of thinking abstractly.

...wait
Permalink muppet 
March 22nd, 2005
One thing I found annoying about Perl wasn't so much the language as libraries - CPAN in particular. Trying to find one that I did need was a pain, and finding one that actually worked was worse. I frequently wind up Googling for the answer and copy-pasting. (I'm pretty new to Perl, obviously, and don't use it much.)
Permalink Aaron F Stanton 
March 22nd, 2005
Really??!! I find CPAN to be FAR SUPERIOR to any similiar offering by any other language. Finding libraries on CPAN is an absolute JOY. There is NOTHING comparable for PHP or Java or any other language. There's attempts at a Java version, and even a PHP one, but they don't even come CLOSE.

Anything I've EVER needed to do with Perl, I've been able to find a library for on CPAN. I freaking LOVE CPAN.
Permalink muppet 
March 22nd, 2005
Oh, CPAN seemed really cool to me until I actually tried to do something constructive with it, and it left a really bad taste in my mouth. It's awesome the way you can pull down libraries and have it pull down dependencies and build them all from source. It's like updating Gentoo.

It was just astoundingly annoying to find a library that claimed to do exactly what I wanted, and it didn't do anything like what it claimed. Feh. Even the example code failed.
Permalink Aaron F Stanton 
March 22nd, 2005
Yep, Aaron, there are a few idiots who post crap code to CPAN, but they're a minority, and it's still a fantasic tool.
Permalink muppet 
March 22nd, 2005
I hope I find it more useful the next time I have something to do in Perl. Right now (well, when I get back to the office - home with a sick kid today) I am working on some stuff in Java.
Permalink Aaron F Stanton 
March 22nd, 2005
Why do we forgive XML/HTML, but we can forgive VB/Ruby

<ThisisGoingToBeAlotOfTyping>
<WellIguessItIsOk />
</ThisisGoingToBeAlotOfTyping>
Permalink Berlin Brown 
March 22nd, 2005
The entire premise of HTML/XML is paired delimiters which enclose data or presentation elements. For HTML and XML, such a structure is a logical extension of their function.

For a programming language, a syntax that is supposed to represent a logical progression, "bookending" all of the elements makes no sense.
Permalink muppet 
March 22nd, 2005
For example, in PHP there is only one kind of code block. It is encased in { ... }

A code block can be standalone, or it can be subject to any number of loop operators. It is a logical construct. But there is still only one kind of block, with one delimiter.

In XML, you can have a <document>, or an <emailMessage>, or a <cat>, or an <employee>, or a <genome>...

In ruby, why the fuck do I need define ... end when { } would do?
Permalink muppet 
March 22nd, 2005
XML is similar, once you know a better alternative:
(ThisisGoingToBeAlotOfTyping WellIguessItIsOk)

instead of:
<ThisisGoingToBeAlotOfTyping>
<WellIguessItIsOk />
</ThisisGoingToBeAlotOfTyping>


Now, if you desire verbosity for a certain app:
(ThisisGoingToBeAlotOfTyping WellIguessItIsOk
);</ThisisGoingToBeAlotOfTyping>
Permalink Tayssir John Gabbour 
March 22nd, 2005

This topic was orginally posted to the off-topic forum of the
Joel on Software discussion board.

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