Anything else just isn't Enterprise enough.

The full memo

The gizmodo link provided earlier omits a couple of things. This pdf which comes from the Stefan M interview page appears to be the original memo.

https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/3914586/Googles-Ideological-Echo-Chamber.pdf
Permalink , Cup 
August 9th, 2017 6:35pm
Yes?  And anyone who starts a so-called "logical, reasonable" memo with "Your leftist ideology blinds you to the reality of the situation" is obviously not acting logically and reasonably.

I think they were right to fire him.
Permalink SaveTheHubble 
August 9th, 2017 6:39pm
"Your leftist ideology blinds you to the reality of the situation"

Liar. He didn't write that.
Permalink NPR 
August 9th, 2017 6:59pm
Background1
People generally have good intentions, but we all have biases which are invisible to us.
Thankfully, open and honest discussion with those who disagree can highlight our blind spots
and help us grow, which is why I wrote this document2. Google has several biases and honest
discussion about these biases is being silenced by the dominant ideology. What follows is by no
means the complete story, but it’s a perspective that desperately needs to be told at Google.
Permalink NPR 
August 9th, 2017 7:00pm
He even points out the good and bad points ("blind spots") of left *and* right biases.
Permalink NPR 
August 9th, 2017 7:01pm
> Liar. He didn't write that.

+1 NPR

why are you making shit up, Hubble?
Permalink Bob B 
August 9th, 2017 8:36pm
I was summarizing.
Permalink SaveTheHubble 
August 9th, 2017 8:46pm
Don't worry, people have been claiming to use science to justify racism and sexism throughout history. 

>As far as deterministic claims go, Damore’s are redundant — he could have just copy-pasted the text of one of thousands of these written in the early 20th century — and also milder than many. In the past few centuries, the same line of argument has been used to argue for the racial superiority of whites, the inferiority of women, and to justify transphobia. (Indeed, Damore does present sex as binary and rigid — there’s no discussion that the mere idea of two sexes may be a myth, a fact that is supported by science.) 

http://www.salon.com/2017/08/08/the-ugly-pseudoscientific-history-behind-that-sexist-google-manifesto/

Besides, the guy who posted that manifesto has been interviewing all over the alt-right media, so that tells everyone extremely clearly where his loyalties lay.   

>James Damore, the Google software engineer fired on Monday for writing an anti-diversity memo that went viral over the weekend, gave his first interviews to supportive YouTube personalities. The separate interviews were conducted by Jordan B. Peterson and Stefan Molyneux, both controversial alt-right commentators.
http://www.salon.com/2017/08/09/fired-google-employee-turns-to-alt-right-youtube-figures-for-first-interviews/
Permalink Pie is a lot better than fine 
August 9th, 2017 10:17pm
Right. Shoot the messenger!
Permalink Rk 
August 10th, 2017 12:45am
>> And anyone so-called leftist is obviously not acting logically and reasonably. <<

Hub - I just summerized what you said and even used exactly your own words.
Permalink Pete 
August 10th, 2017 8:49am
%s/summerized/summarized/g
Permalink Pete 
August 10th, 2017 8:56am
"I think they were right to fire him."

I agree.
Permalink Yoda 
August 10th, 2017 9:53am
I would fire him cause I want a real engineer at his job.
Permalink WorldRoverski 
August 10th, 2017 10:08am
"There are biological differences between women and man."

Yoda: Mysogenist! Fired!

"There are generic differences between Australian Aboriginal people and Scandinavian people."

Yoda: Racist! Fired!
Permalink Pete 
August 10th, 2017 10:55am
@Roverski

Don't be so pathetic. Just because the guy does not have comp sci degree it doesn't mean he is a bad developer.

In fact he may be better than many people with engineering degrees.
Permalink Pete 
August 10th, 2017 11:00am
@Pete

You're dumb, aren't you?
Permalink Yoda 
August 10th, 2017 11:16am
Be careful Yoda!

If you claim someone is more dumb than you - this is discrimination and shows you are a bigot.
Permalink Pete 
August 10th, 2017 11:38am
Thanks for the confirmation.
Permalink Yoda 
August 10th, 2017 12:37pm
What confirmation?

Calling me names does not confirm anything related to the point you made - that James Damore deserved being fired.


Please provide undoctorred paragraph from his article that supports your assertion!
Permalink Pete 
August 10th, 2017 12:59pm
Why should I show you respect if you started by not showing me respect?
Permalink Yoda 
August 10th, 2017 2:08pm
You don't have to show me respect.


You should have shown some respect for the Google guy who got fired for speaking up.

"I agree he should have been fired" - no reason, no analysis, nothing.

This guy got attacked everywhere using fake summaries and quotes. Almost nobody read the original memo.
Permalink Pete 
August 10th, 2017 2:24pm
I skimmed it, it's stupid and ignorant.
Permalink Yoda 
August 10th, 2017 2:32pm
I read the full memo.  Yes it's stupid and arrogant.
Permalink SaveTheHubble 
August 10th, 2017 2:37pm
But it's not irrelevant.
Permalink Rk 
August 10th, 2017 3:22pm
"Be open about  the  science  of  human  nature.
○ Once we acknowledge  that  not  all  differences  are  socially  constructed  or  due  to discrimination,  we  open our  eyes  to  a  more  accurate  view  of  the  human  condition which  is  necessary  if  we  actually  want  to  solve  problems."

Oh - the horror!
Permalink Pete 
August 10th, 2017 4:35pm
We're all different but to be a programmer you have to be exactly the same.
Permalink Send private email Almost Anonymous 
August 10th, 2017 4:59pm
"But it's not irrelevant."

He makes a few good points (that gender stereotypes hurt men too; that corporate approaches to equality issues can be blunt, ineffective or have harmful side-effects; that a commercial company's primary mission is to run a profitable business, not engage in political/ideological crusades), but they got buried under a ton of bigotry, ignorance and plain stupidity. Ironically, he himself found himself at the receiving end of one of his proposals: Google, instead of fretting over limits to freedom of speech, decided to do what's best for Google as a whole (including the large % of its workforce which is female) and fired him.
Permalink Yoda 
August 10th, 2017 6:03pm
Bigotry?
Permalink Rk 
August 10th, 2017 7:20pm
Yes, bigotry.
Permalink Yoda 
August 10th, 2017 7:40pm
And prejudice.
Permalink Yoda 
August 10th, 2017 7:41pm
Maybe.
Permalink Rk 
August 10th, 2017 7:51pm
The majority of the memo is fairly innocuous. His presupposition of the myth of the gender pay gap would of course attract controversy but it did get me thinking, as all good writing should. What if, in a given job category, all the woman-hours worked were added up and divided into the dollars paid (including sick leave etc), and similarly man-dollars divided by man-hours. Would rates be roughly similar between women and men? Don't forget that some women are paid maternity leave while not working hours.
Permalink , Cup 
August 11th, 2017 10:33am

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